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The Force Is Gone!; (Merged)
Topic Started: May 3 2007, 11:54 AM (1,933 Views)
franscar
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Mikael Forssell
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If you say you're looking to offload a player, their value plummets. Do you think we would've got anything approaching the sum we did for Upson or Pennant had Bruce come out and said "yeah, they can leave, we're not that bothered about keeping them"?

Anything that any manager says about a player should be treated with a pinch of salt. £1million for a player who has contributed next to nothing in three years is a good price.
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pgmayhew
Steve Claridge
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Barry O' Loughlin
May 3 2007, 02:42 PM
christovskiblue
May 3 2007, 03:35 PM
Blooboy
May 3 2007, 12:08 PM
for once i feel sorry for the player, good luck Mikael.  needless to say Blues were warned...  he failed a medical at Everton, that alone would have been enough for me to be put off.  Just feel Steve was too sentimental towards the player that had scored a lot of goals for us in a prevoius season. 

good luck The Force!!

yep your right...i know someone from behind the scenes at everton and he 100% assures me forssell didnt even come close to passing the medical...wonder if he will have a medical with hannover??got a feeling they know the risks and wont bother :angel: good luck forse but imo brucie made the right decision, we cant pin our hopes on a injury prone player and the 25k a week can go on whoever brucie brings in to replace bendtner...still think earnie shud be top of the list!! :banner:

I remember at the time that there were rumours that Everton looked at Forse and didn't even bother going through the formality of a medical, so sure were they that he wouldn't pass.
I have never actually seen this story backed up, though, other than "my mate's brother drinks in a pub with the cousin of someone who works at Goodison and he heard......" type stories.

The story is well and truly correct. On hearing of everton's interest in Forssell the deal was put together and signed without forss ever taking a medical at Blues. He took one after the contract in which it was decided to rehabilitate him over the summer but the truth of the matter is that it was a gamble by the board which unfortunately didn't pay off.

Also want to put an end to the comments that £1m is a ridiculous transfer fee. For hopefully the last time, the basis of a transfer fee is the amount that a club has pay to persuade the selling club to release the player from his contract so that he can enter one with them.

Contracts are valued on the basis of two interlinked factors: (i) how long they have left to run on their contract and (ii) how much value the club places on the contract. The situation then cmes down to the bargaining power of the parties. So here goes...

(i) If a player has one year left to run on their contract, they obtain their entitlements under it until it expires or is bought out. They may or may not sign a new contract. So Hannover could wait until next year and sign Forssell for free if they suspect that Blues don't want to offer him a new contract which isn't that inconceivable. Weigh this up against Blues keeping a player that may not even likely feature again and the annual cost of keeping him for an extra year.

(ii) Given that Forssell has played next to no games in the last year or two for Blues, why should a prospective buyer accept a massive valuation especially in his current condition? There is little bargaining power for a club selling a player that has done next to nothing in the last two and a half years.

Now the only way to stop this situation would be to get Forssell to sign a new contract. Now this would inevitably involve a signing on fee, which if it is to be a long term contract could potentially cost around £1m followed by the weekly salary (which is the highest of the club). So shell out £1m on a player with an injury record to extend his contract. Now while you have increased the value in terms of length you have not changed factor (ii). So if the player is not attractive to a buyer (and if he gets injured again), you are left paying his salary for the next 3/4/5 years at a cost of millions more ont op.

Forss is probably not worth more than £1m and economically and legally it is the most likely vlauation. Sorry for the lecture but this is the reality, not football manager on the PC!! < <

Personally i'd like to wish Forss the best of luck and thanks for the memories. **thumbup
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wardendbluenose
Alex Govan
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franscar
May 3 2007, 04:23 PM
£1million for a player who has contributed next to nothing in three years is a good price.

But why keep him on the payroll for so long if were not going to give him a chance to play? Has everybody concerned at the club accepted now that he is not ever going to be able to compete in the first team?

I don't see the point of nursing him back to (full?) fitness and then selling him for a small fee at the first opportunity. £1m is not much, if he returned and became a success he'd be worth more.
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franscar
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Mikael Forssell
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wardendbluenose
May 3 2007, 05:05 PM
franscar
May 3 2007, 04:23 PM
£1million for a player who has contributed next to nothing in three years is a good price.

But why keep him on the payroll for so long if were not going to give him a chance to play? Has everybody concerned at the club accepted now that he is not ever going to be able to compete in the first team?

I don't see the point of nursing him back to (full?) fitness and then selling him for a small fee at the first opportunity. £1m is not much, if he returned and became a success he'd be worth more.

Because if he wasn't fit nobody would give us a penny for him, let alone a million pounds.

Consider that Michael Owen was younger, fitter, and had spent the last three years scoring goals for fun, but because he was in the last year of his contract Liverpool had to take £8million from Real Madrid for him. Michael Owen was worth a hell of a lot more than that, but because it was the last year of his contract £8million was the going rate.

Would you prefer Forssell to get injured again next season, contribute nothing for his £25k a week, then leave for nothing?
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pgmayhew
Steve Claridge
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wardendbluenose
May 3 2007, 05:05 PM
franscar
May 3 2007, 04:23 PM
£1million for a player who has contributed next to nothing in three years is a good price.

But why keep him on the payroll for so long if were not going to give him a chance to play? Has everybody concerned at the club accepted now that he is not ever going to be able to compete in the first team?

I don't see the point of nursing him back to (full?) fitness and then selling him for a small fee at the first opportunity. £1m is not much, if he returned and became a success he'd be worth more.

If he wasn't kept on the payroll then his contract would have to be terminated. That would cost the club a pretty penny. The only other way of getting rid would be find a club to buy out his contract? And who (apart from blues :P ) would want to buy an injured player??

So the rationale is keep him on, make him saleable and try and cut the losses. The money received will likely offset the amount that he cost to keep on the payroll last season. So Blues will have lost the £3m transfer fees and his weekly salary up until last year to the extent that this has been reduced in terms of value for money by his appearances and goals since the move.

Forss says he is fit but his injury is latent. He may last a bit longer in Germany as its a different ball game in terms of tempo but Blues are simply offsetting the risk of getting nothing next year against the risk of spending a small fortune on an extended contract and hoping Forssell can return. As you say it is "IF" he comes back and that is the risk. It seems that is not a risk Blues want to take and thats their analysis!! It might come back to bite them, it might not. Thats the world of business for you!!
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wardendbluenose
Alex Govan
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franscar
May 3 2007, 05:13 PM
wardendbluenose
May 3 2007, 05:05 PM
franscar
May 3 2007, 04:23 PM
£1million for a player who has contributed next to nothing in three years is a good price.

But why keep him on the payroll for so long if were not going to give him a chance to play? Has everybody concerned at the club accepted now that he is not ever going to be able to compete in the first team?

I don't see the point of nursing him back to (full?) fitness and then selling him for a small fee at the first opportunity. £1m is not much, if he returned and became a success he'd be worth more.

Because if he wasn't fit nobody would give us a penny for him, let alone a million pounds.

Consider that Michael Owen was younger, fitter, and had spent the last three years scoring goals for fun, but because he was in the last year of his contract Liverpool had to take £8million from Real Madrid for him. Michael Owen was worth a hell of a lot more than that, but because it was the last year of his contract £8million was the going rate.

Would you prefer Forssell to get injured again next season, contribute nothing for his £25k a week, then leave for nothing?

You have missed my point, why cut our losses now? The amount of money we have spent on transfer fees, wages etc. on Forse, to sell him now it surely means that someone at Blues has admitted that he will never be the same player so were getting what we can.

Would'nt we have been better off giving him a chance to prove his worth and maybe increase any future transfer fees. We've lost so much money it would be worth a gamble :unsure:

But at the end of the day £1m is £1m for the kitty, we spent that much on Larsson.

Best of luck Forse, I hope you can get back to your best :Blues:
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franscar
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Mikael Forssell
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wardendbluenose
May 3 2007, 05:23 PM
You have missed my point, why cut our losses now? The amount of money we have spent on transfer fees, wages etc. on Forse, to sell him now it surely means that someone at Blues has admitted that he will never be the same player so were getting what we can.

Yes, that's exactly what we're doing. And it's the right course of action.
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tomsta
Peter Enckelman
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he must be given one more chance
s/b said not so long ago or was it e/b he is back to his best
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BCFCsam
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Im sorry but he's awful, slow and rubbish tbh, hes lost it and im glad hes gone probs cleared 15k+ on wages!
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jackoblue
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Geoff Horsfield
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bornblues64
May 3 2007, 02:34 PM
Oh and by the way if we are blaming the board for buying players etc, Bruce would have kept Upson, the board pulled off what was a magnificent transfer in theory getting millions for nothing.

But they never get credit with some people do they??

Funny how people who seem to hold the board culpable for everything usually absolve Bruce from anything bad.

To suggest the board bought Forsell and the manager didnt want to is nothing short of ridiculous.

It's always been the same.

If a player comes in and is deemed a success then it's claimed that Bruce signed him. On the other hand if that player is perceived a failure then it said that the Board wanted him.

Of course it can never be Bruce's fault can it? On three occasions since the turn of the year Bruce has admitted that he has pushed players too hard and has misjudged their physical condition. Those players being Bendtner, Forssell and Andy Cole. I often wonder how many more of our players he's knackered due to his misjudgement.

Good luck MF and best wishes. I've no doubt you'll flourish once you've escaped from the ruinous Bruce.


Jackoblue
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elseb
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Paul Tait
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Good luck MF :)
I think it was inevitable that he would be leaving to be honest.
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DEdblue
Paul Tait
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Lars_Dudley
May 3 2007, 01:24 PM
I am still of the opinion of out with the old, in with the new. But £1m for him is ridiculous. He is still a quality striker and from what I gather he is being sold against his will. What kind of impression does that give the other players in the squad? If you get injured and still want to play for us it doesnt matter 'cause you'll be booted out the door for the first bid? "no"

Dont worry about the Money, we have another £59,mill on the way.
**thumbup :D :LOL:
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Sam Tyler
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yaay another crock off the books **thumbup
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franscar
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Mikael Forssell
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jackoblue
May 3 2007, 07:37 PM
If a player comes in and is deemed a success then it's claimed that Bruce signed him. On the other hand if that player is perceived a failure then it said that the Board wanted him.

Of course it can never be Bruce's fault can it?

That's funny, because all I've heard for the past three years is Bruce blamed for any transfer that went badly, and Bruce's role in any transfer that went well ignored and/or minimized.

But it doesn't help an agenda to look at the whole picture does it?
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brooka8
Garry Pendrey
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all the best forse, good luck in a team where you might get a chance to play regularly **thumbup all u needed was another chance well done bruce and the board wtf** :banghead:
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Deleted User
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brumjaep
May 3 2007, 12:59 PM
The board who brought him in, not Bruce. Bruce didnt wanna pay the £3million for him becuase of his injuries and the risk but the board bought him anyway.

How do you know this, as well as Allardyce's whereabouts?

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ESONEULB
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Bluenose Ad Vitam = Bluenose For Life
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Yep all the best forse.....Thanks for the goals :applause:

Good Luck were ever you end up. **thumbup

:Blues:
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Aussiebrum
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Mikael Forssell
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jassyblue80
May 3 2007, 01:36 PM
the board are there to run a business, if it makes more sense to sell a player then thats what they have to do!

Respectfully, not quite right.

They are there as custodians of the shareholders investment.

They are there to manage the asset of the shareholders, the trading business is one part of this.

And for what it's worth, I feel they have done a good job.
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Blue64
Bob Hatton
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jackoblue
May 3 2007, 07:37 PM
bornblues64
May 3 2007, 02:34 PM
Oh and by the way if we are blaming the board for buying players etc, Bruce would have kept Upson, the board pulled off what was a magnificent transfer in theory getting millions for nothing.

But they never get credit with some people do they??

Funny how people who seem to hold the board culpable for everything usually absolve Bruce from anything bad.

To suggest the board bought Forsell and the manager didnt want to is nothing short of ridiculous.

It's always been the same.

If a player comes in and is deemed a success then it's claimed that Bruce signed him. On the other hand if that player is perceived a failure then it said that the Board wanted him.

Of course it can never be Bruce's fault can it? On three occasions since the turn of the year Bruce has admitted that he has pushed players too hard and has misjudged their physical condition. Those players being Bendtner, Forssell and Andy Cole. I often wonder how many more of our players he's knackered due to his misjudgement.

Good luck MF and best wishes. I've no doubt you'll flourish once you've escaped from the ruinous Bruce.


Jackoblue

:silence: tomatoes
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gypsum fantastic
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Martin Grainger
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Good luck to him, he's had terrible injury trouble a big shame.

I'm glad that Blues are clearing the squad of the sicknotes though, Dunn, Forrsell, Upson, while they're great players they all spent way too much time injured!
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blueberry
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Frank Worthington
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It's sad news, and as others have said, it seems pretty cheap to me. I won't be surprised if he becomes a big success in Germany - another Pandiani!

Having said that, I understand the business reasons for letting him go. It all depends on who we get in to replace him.

Best of luck Mikael!! Thanks for some great goals! **thumbup
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Zico
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Bob Hatton
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It's a shame it never worked out for him here. I'll never forget that season he was on fire, he was a pleasure to watch.

I look forward to hearing that he's scored 12 goals in 15 matches halfway through next season. :rolleyes:
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benjaminl14
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Martin Taylor
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In the Independent today - Forssel is set to complete a £1 Million move to German side Hanover. He is poised to sign when the transfer window reopens on June 1st subject to sorting out contractual issues with the Blues. "I want to be playing first team football", the finnish striker said.


:crying:
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Zico
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Bob Hatton
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Ahem, *cough* five threads beneath this one....?

http://z4.invisionfree.com/BLUES_FORUM/ind...showtopic=29464
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benjaminl14
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Martin Taylor
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Yeah fair play. In the heat of the emotion my vision became clouded...

Well if anyone wants to see a well written post they can look at mine! (or this will be deleted, whatever!).


tomatoes
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