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Why I Don't Buy The Birmingham Mail
Topic Started: Jun 3 2010, 05:19 PM (2,494 Views)
dr.nick
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Trevor Francis
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These type of threads annoy me , here we have a bloke might be innocent might be guilty but because he's a ' supposedly' a football hooligan he's the devil reincarnated.

So what if in the 70s a and early 80s he had a fight at a football match how fo you know he wasn't the victim and just defending himself ?

I know from people who were in Portugal 2004 that some of the police were overzelous , this may be a case of heavy handed policing because England got a little over excited

But let's listen to the jounolists , they won't lie or exagderate will they.
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B25 YEWTREE LOYAL
Alex Govan
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Mate no..do i know him yes
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B25 YEWTREE LOYAL
Alex Govan
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I know from people who were in Portugal 2004 that some of the police were overzelous , this may be a case of heavy handed policing because England got a little over excited

Dr Nick that doesnt matter ...hooligans rank below Gary Glitter for some

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Blue Raphealite
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Paul Tait
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lowdham bluenose
Jun 4 2010, 09:32 AM

So what about Fulham? - they have the huge clubs of Chelsea, Arsenal and Spurs on their doorstep, yet still get bigger average gates than Blues. What do people love most about Fulham? - fan friendly and hooligan free.


Whilst I agree with your sentiments about ridding football of the neanderthals - you do tend to shoot yourself in the foot with your exagerations mate :D

Fulham - Average attendance: 23,909 ( In a year they got to a European Final). Biggest gate:25,700

Blues - Average attendance: 25,246 . Biggest Gate:28,958

:rolleyes:
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Deleted User
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I think it's wrong to condemn a man before he's even been found guilty of a crime.
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irish_blues_boy
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Olivier Tebily
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bluenose abroad
Jun 4 2010, 10:41 AM
I think it's wrong to condemn a man before he's even been found guilty of a crime.

It is wrong.

However, always amuses me how Irish fans are never up on charges of hooliganism.

you English boys have a bad rep, and a small portion of English supporters ruin it for everyone. We quite simply don't stand for Irish national fans behaving in such a fashion. I have met good english fans all over the world but the fact is there is an element of 5cum who ruin everything for the grassroots, intelligent, well-bahaved supporters.

Honestly, and I don't mean this patronisingly....I feel sorry for most English supporters.
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West Heath Blue
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Mann, 52, a retired Kent firefighter, was arrested three hours after the riot in Albufeira on the Algarve and convicted within 24 hours under a fast-track process brought in for the championships. The court had one English-speaking interpreter, two lawyers representing 12 men and little opportunity for the accused to call witnesses.

Detective Constable Alan Rutter, an officer with Humberside police who attended the trial to advise Portuguese police on English supporters at Euro 2004, described the trial as a farce. He said there was no adequate interpretation and Mann did not understand most of the proceedings.


To the judge and jury on here, you make me sick.

What you do if you found yourself in this situation eh?????

Oh and unless you are completely squeaky clean you have no right to judge an innocent man.
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blueblood
Johnny Vincent
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Blue Raphealite
Jun 4 2010, 11:40 AM
lowdham bluenose
Jun 4 2010, 09:32 AM

So what about Fulham? - they have the huge clubs of Chelsea, Arsenal and Spurs on their doorstep, yet still get bigger average gates than Blues. What do people love most about Fulham? - fan friendly and hooligan free.


Whilst I agree with your sentiments about ridding football of the neanderthals - you do tend to shoot yourself in the foot with your exagerations mate :D

Fulham - Average attendance: 23,909 ( In a year they got to a European Final). Biggest gate:25,700

Blues - Average attendance: 25,246 . Biggest Gate:28,958

:rolleyes:

well said. but lowdham will ignore your post **thumbup
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Deleted User
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West Heath Blue
Jun 4 2010, 10:57 AM
Mann, 52, a retired Kent firefighter, was arrested three hours after the riot in Albufeira on the Algarve and convicted within 24 hours under a fast-track process brought in for the championships. The court had one English-speaking interpreter, two lawyers representing 12 men and little opportunity for the accused to call witnesses.

Detective Constable Alan Rutter, an officer with Humberside police who attended the trial to advise Portuguese police on English supporters at Euro 2004, described the trial as a farce. He said there was no adequate interpretation and Mann did not understand most of the proceedings.


To the judge and jury on here, you make me sick.

What you do if you found yourself in this situation eh?????

Oh and unless you are completely squeaky clean you have no right to judge an innocent man.

:applause:

Well said mate.
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dr.nick
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Trevor Francis
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B25 YEWTREE LOYAL
Jun 4 2010, 10:34 AM
I know from people who were in Portugal 2004 that some of the police were overzelous , this may be a case of heavy handed policing because England got a little over excited

Dr Nick that doesnt matter ...hooligans rank below Gary Glitter for some

I know mate and it's all media driven.

The trouble in albiwhatsitsname happened because of bad policing.

If that was a cnd march it's the polices fault if it's football supporters it's the hooligans fault.

Both groups will fight throw chairs and what not but football supporters are instantly condemed.

Strange that.
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bluehag
Peter Enckelman
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I've read a few of these type of threads now and practically every time its the people who condemn hooligans and preach calm and fairness and responsibility that are the first to cast the first stone and want to spout off about what should be done to them, usually without knowing the full facts. I really wouldn't want some of you on my jury if I were an innocent man, because you are so predujiced that you hear a keyword such as "hooliganism" and make your minds up in an instant. Just show enough compassion to get the full facts before spouting off about someone elses life, it will also stand you in good stead for life in general.
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West Heath Blue
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bluehag
Jun 4 2010, 05:56 PM
I've read a few of these type of threads now and practically every time its the people who condemn hooligans and preach calm and fairness and responsibility that are the first to cast the first stone and want to spout off about what should be done to them, usually without knowing the full facts. I really wouldn't want some of you on my jury if I were an innocent man, because you are so predujiced that you hear a keyword such as "hooliganism" and make your minds up in an instant. Just show enough compassion to get the full facts before spouting off about someone elses life, it will also stand you in good stead for life in general.

Well said :applause:
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bluenose71
Martin Grainger
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:applause: well said,innocent until proven guilty and all that.
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PartisanBCFC
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Jack Wiseman
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bluenose71
Jun 4 2010, 01:00 PM
:applause: well said,innocent until proven guilty and all that.

I couldn't agree more

And I did state earlier that if Gary Mann is truly innocent then he'd get my wholehearted sympathy

Has he even returned to Portugal yet ??

Why are the British Government not doing more to help him especially as the accused feels he's on the end of the witch hunt ?

What annoys me is B25 Yew Tree's stance that because he's a firefighter and used to save lives that somehow he's above the law

Ted Bundy and Doctor Crippen were extremely articulate, well respected and intelligent people.....but both brutally murdered women......as was Jack The Ripper who is believed to have had extensive medical knowledge as he dissected female victims still grasping for their last breath and seemingly got away with it

Some people on here make me laugh ...............If your wife or daughter had her head split open at St Andrews by a housebrick thrown by Gary Mann, you'd be demanded 'Justice' and asking why he was made free and didn't do his time in Portugal ??

Clearly though it didn't help his case that he'd been convicted of trouble at a football match before......True, it might have been a petty offence but it's on his record and that will always come up when the accused is being charged with a similar offence......You'll find that happens every day in the UK Judicial system, just like anywhere else so naturally many folks will put 2 and 2 together.....that's just human nature

Sorry but I just cannot buy into the fact that he was sitting innocently and quietly in a bar with a mate and was suddenly picked out of the crowd by a Portuguese policeman

Are there are other seemingly innocent fans in that same bar who complained of brutality by the law ?? Where are they all ??

How many other fans in this incident were arrested ??

If there were others are they doing time in Portugal as well or were they deported without a trial ?? As Gary Mann clearly indicated he thought that was happening to him

Sorry, but that point alone prods my own instinct that he was a possible ringleader and the principle perpetrator of the trouble

I agree, there are facts we don't know about .....but going back to the original topic, Yes, I would agree he should have been referred to as an England supporter, not a BCFC supporter

Don't knock the Mail too hard, just imagine if The Sun had gotten hold of this story first


:banghead:
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Francis No.8
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Paul Tait
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guest5234
Jun 4 2010, 07:53 AM
Paul Tait's Tee-Shirt
Jun 3 2010, 06:03 PM
They allowed the so-called "journalist" Lisa Smith to advertise a book about the Vile hooligan gang (yes, there was one apparently ! - think it's the one that used to specialise in smashing up their own coaches !)

The rag is totally Pro-Vile, pity, because it hadn't used to be.

Haven't bought it for a while now. I prefer the Metro to read on the train home.

Paranoid or what, I buy it every night and it is not pro-villa at all. still a good read.

I second that mate.
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dr.nick
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Trevor Francis
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some of the besdt people i know are considered hooligans , their not all mindless animals that the media would have you believe, the old zulus just fought the oposition fans thatwanted a row .

this is a witch hunt against not only garry but any oh the people who wanted a row against opposition fans.
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PartisanBCFC
Jun 4 2010, 07:05 AM

Let's all just dis-own him

He's a thug who we all should disassociate with the football club


You agree with innocent until proven guilty do you, parti?
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The Concerned Potato Head
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Big Bawss
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B25 YEWTREE LOYAL
Jun 4 2010, 08:26 AM
lowdham bluenose
Jun 4 2010, 08:16 AM
PartisanBCFC
Jun 4 2010, 08:58 AM
I'll condemn all I want if he is guilty of the charge against him

Quote:
 
Portuguese authorities are trying to extradite Birmingham City fan Garry Mann so he can be punished for inciting a riot in Albufeira during Euro 2004



Quote:
 
Mann, who says he has convictions for disorderly conduct at a football match from 1975 and another for criminal damage in 1981, called on the Government to review the European arrest warrant


Hardly new to it was he ?? If he's innocent fair enough but don't feed me this cr@p about being a firefighter and saving lives so we should forgive and forget .....Firefighters choose to do what they do for a living.....as do Police Officers and soldiers, they know the risks

For a bloke who likely works alongside The Police and Ambulance crews in some everyday situations don't you think he should have known better if he is actually guilty of the charges against him ??

:applause: well said Parti.

There should be no room for these boneheads. How the hell can we progress when still have these neanderthals?

As for fairweather and fickle fans, if we replaced every bonehead with a fairweather then the club would become "sociably - friendly" and guess what? more and more fans would be attracted to coming. We would also lose our negative press and become attractive and guess what? even more fans would be attracted to coming.

Come on Blues, let's become a 21st Century club.

Lowds what a load of old tosh...success is the only thing that fairweather fickle fans aspire to,not a happy friendly love in on a saturday afternoon..The most succesful clubs in the world of football have a far greater crimesheet than Birmingham City..

Man Utd are usually top of the pile when it comes to hooliganism in domestic football
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northside blue
Frank Worthington
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PartisanBCFC
Jun 4 2010, 06:17 PM
bluenose71
Jun 4 2010, 01:00 PM
:applause: well said,innocent until proven guilty and all that.

I couldn't agree more

And I did state earlier that if Gary Mann is truly innocent then he'd get my wholehearted sympathy

Has he even returned to Portugal yet ??

Why are the British Government not doing more to help him especially as the accused feels he's on the end of the witch hunt ?

What annoys me is B25 Yew Tree's stance that because he's a firefighter and used to save lives that somehow he's above the law

Ted Bundy and Doctor Crippen were extremely articulate, well respected and intelligent people.....but both brutally murdered women......as was Jack The Ripper who is believed to have had extensive medical knowledge as he dissected female victims still grasping for their last breath and seemingly got away with it

Some people on here make me laugh ...............If your wife or daughter had her head split open at St Andrews by a housebrick thrown by Gary Mann, you'd be demanded 'Justice' and asking why he was made free and didn't do his time in Portugal ??

Clearly though it didn't help his case that he'd been convicted of trouble at a football match before......True, it might have been a petty offence but it's on his record and that will always come up when the accused is being charged with a similar offence......You'll find that happens every day in the UK Judicial system, just like anywhere else so naturally many folks will put 2 and 2 together.....that's just human nature

Sorry but I just cannot buy into the fact that he was sitting innocently and quietly in a bar with a mate and was suddenly picked out of the crowd by a Portuguese policeman

Are there are other seemingly innocent fans in that same bar who complained of brutality by the law ?? Where are they all ??

How many other fans in this incident were arrested ??

If there were others are they doing time in Portugal as well or were they deported without a trial ?? As Gary Mann clearly indicated he thought that was happening to him

Sorry, but that point alone prods my own instinct that he was a possible ringleader and the principle perpetrator of the trouble

I agree, there are facts we don't know about .....but going back to the original topic, Yes, I would agree he should have been referred to as an England supporter, not a BCFC supporter

Don't knock the Mail too hard, just imagine if The Sun had gotten hold of this story first


:banghead:

From your post you clearly know nothing about the case, just a suggestion but maybe before condeming people you should at least have the decency to do a little research.
Do agree though with your point about just because he is a firefighter doesen't make him hollier than thou, after all look at all the politicians judges coppers who turn out to be peedo's & the like eh & thats in the last few weeks /months/7 days days lol.
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SpokesT
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Frank Worthington
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Please let's all just be friends and stop all the shouting and nastiness :crying:
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northside blue
Frank Worthington
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For those who may be interested, a fundraiser to enable his wife & 6 daughters to visit him in portugal is being held at the sound bar corporation st.
26th june from 4pm - ub40 tribute band plus a ska band/dj hopefully followed by England game live on big screen, ticketa are £5 each.
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PartisanBCFC
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Jack Wiseman
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northside blue
Jun 4 2010, 04:34 PM
, a fundraiser to enable his wife & 6 daughters to visit him in portugal is being held at the sound bar corporation st.

Wife and 6 kids ??? WTF

What was he doing on a jolly with the lads in Portugal then ??

In fact how could he even afford it ??




-----------------------
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PartisanBCFC
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Jack Wiseman
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northside blue
Jun 4 2010, 03:59 PM
  From your post you clearly know nothing about the case, just a suggestion but maybe before condeming people you should at least have the decency to do a little research.

And you do then ??

Well please enlighten us and can you give us a baton blow by baton blow account including the excessive force used by local police simply doing their jobs....just as British bobbies do to restore law and order

First of all.....can you answer the perfectly reasonable questions I raised in my previous post further up


FYI I know the Portuguese Police can seem a very rude and intolerable bunch, I've been to The Algarve twice......I was only double parking once and I had one local copper going ape***t at me .......but he didn't have to get out the mace and pepper spray For Gawd's Sake ......Oh ! and I moved the car in a hurry .....maybe they do things a little different down there .....When in a foreign country it's sometimes best to respect their citizens, their culture and their customs

----------------------
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PartisanBCFC
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Jack Wiseman
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bluenose abroad
Jun 4 2010, 02:43 PM
PartisanBCFC
Jun 4 2010, 07:05 AM

Let's all just dis-own him

He's a thug who we all should disassociate with the football club


You agree with innocent until proven guilty do you, parti?

Yes......but wasn't he found guilty in a court of law ??

Oh ! I know you're famous (or infamous) for stirring up rage on here but I did say this earlier as well.....how Mighty Noble of you to omit this part

Quote:
 
If he's innocent fair enough 


Please, all you people who honestly think this guy is innocent present some worthwhile evidence then .....I'll buy it


KRO
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Deleted User
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PartisanBCFC
Jun 4 2010, 10:41 PM

Yes......but wasn't he found guilty in a court of law ??

Oh ! I know you're famous (or infamous) for stirring up rage on here but I did say this earlier as well.....how Mighty Noble of you to omit this part

Quote:
 
If he's innocent fair enough 



The court case was a sham, evidence provided by a British copper.

You say if he's innocent fair enough, after you've asked every Blues fan to disown him?
This bloke may well be guilty, I don't know. I just think it's wrong to play judge, jury & executioner when you know nothing about the case.
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