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Football Development In Birmingham & The West Mids; is very poor or is it me?
Topic Started: Dec 21 2010, 08:33 AM (440 Views)
clapton bluenose
Alex Govan
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
I have just been thinking that according to the facts Lescott is the best player produced by this region if we judge by transfer fee.

In fact if we look at the regions and compare it to brum / west mids we are shockingly very very poor.

Example -

North East - Shearer, Waddle, Beardsley

Merseyside - Gerrard, Rooney, Fowler,

London - Cole, Ferdinand, lamps

Birmingham - Lescott :banghead:

Our region has failed to produce one player of note to match any of the above in the last 20 odd years.

Discuss.
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alfred E nueman
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Mikael Forssell
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clapton bluenose
Dec 21 2010, 08:33 AM

Our region has failed to produce one player of note to match any of the above in the last 20 odd years.

Discuss.

..zz..
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Holmsie
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Frank Worthington
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To be fair, I sort of agree with this.

The majority of England players (including the very best ones) have USUALLY either come from London, Liverpool or the North-East.

Then Manchester after that.

Then probably Leeds/Yorkshire.

The Birmingham and the odd smattering of generic Midlands... (Foster - Leamington Spa, Hart - Shropshire) etc... Not great really is it.

But interesting aswell... Why do London/North West/North East produce the best home-grown talent?
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Des
Malcom Page
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very good point clapto. if you go back to the greatesy watershed in english football the 66 world cup, it was the same then! Not one brummie in the whole 22 man squad!
sad but true!

KRO
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Lucky
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Bob Latchford
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I was involved in grassroots football for many years ,
The whole system is utter rubbish,bad pitches ,badly run,bad coaching,
Has it changed ,not a bit,if anything its worse,
If any of you are lucky enough to go to Spain or Holland then see the difference in how they treat the Children,
How they coach,
How they play matches,
Pitches they use,
Facilities the have at their disposal,
Then come back and see what we offer,
Then you will find the answer to why we dont have loads of players coming through or even why our national team is struggling.
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Lucky
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Bob Latchford
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alfred E nueman
Dec 21 2010, 01:28 PM
clapton bluenose
Dec 21 2010, 08:33 AM

Our region has failed to produce one player of note to match any of the above in the last 20 odd years.

Discuss.

..zz..

Constructive.
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SHA007
Geoff Horsfield
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Holmsie
Dec 21 2010, 02:41 PM

But interesting aswell... Why do London/North West/North East produce the best home-grown talent?

Football mad.

The East End, Liverpool and Newcastle just live for football - the whole area. They don't produce cricketers or rugby players because they only have an interest in football.

However it is the same regarding music and tv stars. Not much in the West Mids but loads in London and the North West plus two little dicks from Newcastle. It's probably why there are not many celeb supporters of our teams - we don't produce any.



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alfred E nueman
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Mikael Forssell
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Lucky
Dec 21 2010, 04:43 PM
alfred E nueman
Dec 21 2010, 01:28 PM
clapton bluenose
Dec 21 2010, 08:33 AM

Our region has failed to produce one player of note to match any of the above in the last 20 odd years.

Discuss.

..zz..

Constructive.

Yep.

I'm tired mate.

It's easier to whinge at anything than it is to seek out the good and support it.The OP may not have intended a whinge, I just take umbrage at people making a bland statement and saying:

"DISCUSS"

I blame the snow.
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Holmsie
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Frank Worthington
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I'm going to put it out there, and I'll probably get slated for it, but on the basis that there havn't been many (or any?) top quality England internationals from Birmingham, I'd say that Cockney's, Geordies and Scousers/Mancs are more passionate about playing football than us... What other explination is there?
:unsure:
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maulley54
Mikael Forssell
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i suppose one of the last home grown talents was, and i hate to say it steve bull. scored over 300 goals for wolves, played a few times for england and scored 5 goals for them. although to be honest a lot of his wolves goals were scored in the lower leagues. his brother gary played for blues. my cousin lindley jenkins played for blues but only played for the first team twice. and that was years ago. i played for shrewsbury town but that was in 1970 and i only played 9 games cause i wasnt good enough, so i suppose you are correct we just dont produce them.
and i hate to say it the local clubs including blues dont look after the youngsters right
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pooley
The Icon
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with the north east ones your going back years so you can add people like ian taylor in there for one, tony dailey for two
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Holmsie
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Frank Worthington
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maulley54
Dec 21 2010, 06:06 PM
i suppose one of the last home grown talents was, and i hate to say it steve bull. scored over 300 goals for wolves, played a few times for england and scored 5 goals for them. although to be honest a lot of his wolves goals were scored in the lower leagues. his brother gary played for blues. my cousin lindley jenkins played for blues but only played for the first team twice. and that was years ago. i played for shrewsbury town but that was in 1970 and i only played 9 games cause i wasnt good enough, so i suppose you are correct we just dont produce them.
and i hate to say it the local clubs including blues dont look after the youngsters right

Okay fair enough, Steve Bull had a fantastic goal scoring record, same for Lee Hughes.

But I'm talking Shearer/Charlton/Moore/Beckham/Gerrard/Lampard/Scholes/Rooney/Keegan/Adams/Robson/Finney/Lofthouse/Geaves/Gascoigne-quality...

Where are the Brummies?! :(
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Holmsie
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Frank Worthington
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SHA007
Dec 21 2010, 05:50 PM
Holmsie
Dec 21 2010, 02:41 PM

But interesting aswell... Why do London/North West/North East produce the best home-grown talent?

Football mad.

Why is that then??

Why are they more football mad than us?
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alfred E nueman
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Mikael Forssell
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Norfolk, Suffolk.
Cornwall, Devon.
Cumbria,Northumberland
Gloucester, Somerset, Hampshire
Both Sussexes and Surrey.
Leicestershire and Lincolnshire.

County FAs versus the intensity of the cornurbation ( ease of organising).

The mining communities of the North East were famous for footballers - Bill Shankly said you could go to any pit head and yell down for a centre half and most of the shift would come up.

Working class environment, fewer facilities and COUNTY FAs. The West Midlands since the War has been probably better off, less kids playing footie in the street for a start, than other areas that have spent years getting the kids and coaching them.
Shearer's Wallsend YC is a prime example.Partly to get them off the streets. Rooney grew up as a street footballer.

Strategic local planning on a diverse area like the West Midlands is more difficult and we have probably lost a generation or two.

May be passion, but it's also access and opportunity and the dead hand of adminstration from County FAs.

Warwickshire :LMAO:

I'm awake now. :D
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The Concerned Potato Head
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Big Bawss
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Birmingham has a LOT of gifted young kids playing football, trust me on that one. but actually getting those kids off the parks and into academies is a different thing

some players i've played with and against i've been amazed they have never looked for a career in football



i include myself :break:
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Holmsie
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Frank Worthington
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The Concerned Steve bruce
Dec 21 2010, 07:21 PM
Birmingham has a LOT of gifted young kids playing football, trust me on that one. but actually getting those kids off the parks and into academies is a different thing

some players i've played with and against i've been amazed they have never looked for a career in football



i include myself  :break:

Well... something needs to be done about it then.

Quite embarressing when you look through England's most capped and highest goal-scorer's and where they're from...


I for one though will pretend that this fact doesn't exist...

Posted Image
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West Heath Blue
Unregistered

Holmsie
Dec 21 2010, 07:15 PM
maulley54
Dec 21 2010, 06:06 PM
i suppose one of the last home grown talents was, and i hate to say it steve bull. scored over 300 goals for wolves, played a few times for england and scored 5 goals for them. although to be honest a lot of his wolves goals were scored in the lower leagues. his brother gary played for blues. my cousin lindley jenkins played for blues but only played for the first team twice. and that was years ago. i played for shrewsbury town but that was in 1970 and i only played 9 games cause i wasnt good enough, so i suppose you are correct we just dont produce them.
and i hate to say it the local clubs including blues dont look after the youngsters right

Okay fair enough, Steve Bull had a fantastic goal scoring record, same for Lee Hughes.

But I'm talking Shearer/Charlton/Moore/Beckham/Gerrard/Lampard/Scholes/Rooney/Keegan/Adams/Robson/Finney/Lofthouse/Geaves/Gascoigne-quality...

Where are the Brummies?! :(

The only real one i can think of in fairly recent times would be Kings Nortons own Alan Smith at Arsenal.
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Holmsie
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Frank Worthington
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West Heath Blue
Dec 21 2010, 07:57 PM
Holmsie
Dec 21 2010, 07:15 PM
maulley54
Dec 21 2010, 06:06 PM
i suppose one of the last home grown talents was, and i hate to say it steve bull. scored over 300 goals for wolves, played a few times for england and scored 5 goals for them. although to be honest a lot of his wolves goals were scored in the lower leagues. his brother gary played for blues. my cousin lindley jenkins played for blues but only played for the first team twice. and that was years ago. i played for shrewsbury town but that was in 1970 and i only played 9 games cause i wasnt good enough, so i suppose you are correct we just dont produce them.
and i hate to say it the local clubs including blues dont look after the youngsters right

Okay fair enough, Steve Bull had a fantastic goal scoring record, same for Lee Hughes.

But I'm talking Shearer/Charlton/Moore/Beckham/Gerrard/Lampard/Scholes/Rooney/Keegan/Adams/Robson/Finney/Lofthouse/Geaves/Gascoigne-quality...

Where are the Brummies?! :(

The only real one i can think of in fairly recent times would be Kings Nortons own Alan Smith at Arsenal.

True. Played for Alvechurch didn't he.

He also never states in public if he supports Blues or Vile... My money would be on Blues though ;)
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clapton bluenose
Alex Govan
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Holmsie
Dec 21 2010, 07:34 PM
The Concerned Steve bruce
Dec 21 2010, 07:21 PM
Birmingham has a LOT of gifted young kids playing football, trust me on that one. but actually getting those kids off the parks and into academies is a different thing

some players i've played with and against i've been amazed they have never looked for a career in football



i include myself  :break:

Well... something needs to be done about it then.

Quite embarressing when you look through England's most capped and highest goal-scorer's and where they're from...


I for one though will pretend that this fact doesn't exist...

Posted Image

This is the kind of reaction I was hoping for tbh.

I firmly believe we can produce players of the calibre to match any region in England.

If London can then why can't we? I went down the hackney marshes the other week with a mate down from leeds looking for a local side that I am thinking of getting involved with.

I was quite shocked at how small the pitches were the touch lines were within 2 yards of the penalty area it was quite surprising.

I immediately started thinking we had better pitches than that to play on in the birmingham area (when I was a kid) so what is the explanation?

I think threads like this need to be shown to the youth development officials that oversee football in the region for young kids. To hear their views on why we are not producing top top players.

Young sturridge at chelsea looks a good prospect can anyone tell me why he chose cov as a youngster?

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clapton bluenose
Alex Govan
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West Heath Blue
Dec 21 2010, 07:57 PM
Holmsie
Dec 21 2010, 07:15 PM
maulley54
Dec 21 2010, 06:06 PM
i suppose one of the last home grown talents was, and i hate to say it steve bull. scored over 300 goals for wolves, played a few times for england and scored 5 goals for them. although to be honest a lot of his wolves goals were scored in the lower leagues. his brother gary played for blues. my cousin lindley jenkins played for blues but only played for the first team twice. and that was years ago. i played for shrewsbury town but that was in 1970 and i only played 9 games cause i wasnt good enough, so i suppose you are correct we just dont produce them.
and i hate to say it the local clubs including blues dont look after the youngsters right

Okay fair enough, Steve Bull had a fantastic goal scoring record, same for Lee Hughes.

But I'm talking Shearer/Charlton/Moore/Beckham/Gerrard/Lampard/Scholes/Rooney/Keegan/Adams/Robson/Finney/Lofthouse/Geaves/Gascoigne-quality...

Where are the Brummies?! :(

The only real one i can think of in fairly recent times would be Kings Nortons own Alan Smith at Arsenal.

I think Alan Smith is a good example of what is probably wrong with footy in this region. He was at lowly Alvechurch before being discovered. The same of David Kelly.

The fact that they had to start at a lowly clubs shows we are not doing something right. One of my mates played against middlesboro in the fa cup when Bryan Robson was manager and he was told had he being younger he would have been offered a contract at the time he was playing for hednesford town.

From the age of 16 players seem to drift because there is no system in place to capture them before they get into beer and all sorts. Thats how it appears to me anyway.
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SHA007
Geoff Horsfield
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Holmsie
Dec 21 2010, 08:53 PM
West Heath Blue
Dec 21 2010, 07:57 PM
Holmsie
Dec 21 2010, 07:15 PM
maulley54
Dec 21 2010, 06:06 PM
i suppose one of the last home grown talents was, and i hate to say it steve bull. scored over 300 goals for wolves, played a few times for england and scored 5 goals for them. although to be honest a lot of his wolves goals were scored in the lower leagues. his brother gary played for blues. my cousin lindley jenkins played for blues but only played for the first team twice. and that was years ago. i played for shrewsbury town but that was in 1970 and i only played 9 games cause i wasnt good enough, so i suppose you are correct we just dont produce them.
and i hate to say it the local clubs including blues dont look after the youngsters right

Okay fair enough, Steve Bull had a fantastic goal scoring record, same for Lee Hughes.

But I'm talking Shearer/Charlton/Moore/Beckham/Gerrard/Lampard/Scholes/Rooney/Keegan/Adams/Robson/Finney/Lofthouse/Geaves/Gascoigne-quality...

Where are the Brummies?! :(

The only real one i can think of in fairly recent times would be Kings Nortons own Alan Smith at Arsenal.

True. Played for Alvechurch didn't he.

He also never states in public if he supports Blues or Vile... My money would be on Blues though ;)

Sorry to disappoint to you but he's a Villa. He has said so on Sky when asked if he has any leaning toward either team. He said oh yes, I have to admit Aston Villa.



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bcfcno1fan
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Alex Govan
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SHA007
Dec 22 2010, 01:34 PM
Holmsie
Dec 21 2010, 08:53 PM
West Heath Blue
Dec 21 2010, 07:57 PM
Holmsie
Dec 21 2010, 07:15 PM
maulley54
Dec 21 2010, 06:06 PM
i suppose one of the last home grown talents was, and i hate to say it steve bull. scored over 300 goals for wolves, played a few times for england and scored 5 goals for them. although to be honest a lot of his wolves goals were scored in the lower leagues. his brother gary played for blues. my cousin lindley jenkins played for blues but only played for the first team twice. and that was years ago. i played for shrewsbury town but that was in 1970 and i only played 9 games cause i wasnt good enough, so i suppose you are correct we just dont produce them.
and i hate to say it the local clubs including blues dont look after the youngsters right

Okay fair enough, Steve Bull had a fantastic goal scoring record, same for Lee Hughes.

But I'm talking Shearer/Charlton/Moore/Beckham/Gerrard/Lampard/Scholes/Rooney/Keegan/Adams/Robson/Finney/Lofthouse/Geaves/Gascoigne-quality...

Where are the Brummies?! :(

The only real one i can think of in fairly recent times would be Kings Nortons own Alan Smith at Arsenal.

True. Played for Alvechurch didn't he.

He also never states in public if he supports Blues or Vile... My money would be on Blues though ;)

Sorry to disappoint to you but he's a Villa. He has said so on Sky when asked if he has any leaning toward either team. He said oh yes, I have to admit Aston Villa.

Haha, i was about to post the same thing. Friend of a friends dogs barber sort of thing though! Haha ;)
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Des
Malcom Page
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
Maulley!

Blues had a brochure made to celebrate the 25th anniversary of Freddie Goodwin joining the club. And a big night out with freddie and his team was organised.
There was a picture on the front of the brochure of the whole blues team defending a free kick in the box. The one player no one on our table could recognise was your cuz Lindley Jenkins think it was the 73 or 74 season!!!

KRO
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Jabber BCFC
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Frank Worthington
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Holmsie
Dec 21 2010, 08:53 PM
West Heath Blue
Dec 21 2010, 07:57 PM
Holmsie
Dec 21 2010, 07:15 PM
maulley54
Dec 21 2010, 06:06 PM
i suppose one of the last home grown talents was, and i hate to say it steve bull. scored over 300 goals for wolves, played a few times for england and scored 5 goals for them. although to be honest a lot of his wolves goals were scored in the lower leagues. his brother gary played for blues. my cousin lindley jenkins played for blues but only played for the first team twice. and that was years ago. i played for shrewsbury town but that was in 1970 and i only played 9 games cause i wasnt good enough, so i suppose you are correct we just dont produce them.
and i hate to say it the local clubs including blues dont look after the youngsters right

Okay fair enough, Steve Bull had a fantastic goal scoring record, same for Lee Hughes.

But I'm talking Shearer/Charlton/Moore/Beckham/Gerrard/Lampard/Scholes/Rooney/Keegan/Adams/Robson/Finney/Lofthouse/Geaves/Gascoigne-quality...

Where are the Brummies?! :(

The only real one i can think of in fairly recent times would be Kings Nortons own Alan Smith at Arsenal.

True. Played for Alvechurch didn't he.

He also never states in public if he supports Blues or Vile... My money would be on Blues though ;)

Alvechurch are s***e :P
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Blue Raphealite
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Paul Tait
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The Concerned Steve bruce
Dec 21 2010, 07:21 PM
Birmingham has a LOT of gifted young kids playing football, trust me on that one. but actually getting those kids off the parks and into academies is a different thing

some players i've played with and against i've been amazed they have never looked for a career in football



i include myself  :break:

Scouts don't trawl Parks and Recs anymore.

To watch school football matches they have to be registered via the CPA - - £250 per police area.

I have a nephew who is very good ( I'm told) in a badly organised Sunday League - but it is an unnofficial league and if some seniors want the pitch they get it.

My nephew can't get in the school team. The school team is the one watched by scouts. Our kid could do with some grooming, because he is pretty good but raw.He won't get it and if he goes on to the school his mum wants, he won't play footie again for fun.

School and County FAs are the death of development.As has been said.

On Hackney Marshes you can see a multitude of teams, organised from youth clubs, councils, churches,social groups,ethnic groups even schools. All playing proper matches, side by side, in various and different leagues. And you'd get scouts trawling.
And the players all came from across London.

In the West Midlands we have a desert. Hardly any non-schools organised leagues and even less community organised leagues - they have the teams across Brum, from Chinatown to Solihull.But they play for fun and only now and again.

Organised they could be serious.

Community organised teams with facilities ( pitches changing rooms, leagues, officials etc). Scouts are not going to scout in a desert.And they won't bother with non-developed pub teams - I'm, talking about kids. U15s say.


We don't have the throughput here in the West Midlands - NOT because of ability, but because of facilities, investment, organisation and opportunity.

These are Political decisions and choices.Scouts are not going to scout in a desert.

**thumbup
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