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Neil Moxley replies - Reinstated; Please keep all discussion civil
Topic Started: Feb 7 2011, 10:28 AM (2,860 Views)
robert capa
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Garry Pendrey
[ *  *  *  * ]
blue casual
Feb 8 2011, 01:51 AM

and give up robert capa, try doing some research before you start kissing a*se.  :kiss:

I have ....and you seem to be always first with the latest stories and throwing them into the mix on here for some views.

A journalist would be in the know first wouldnt he? ....

and you write with the same style as Neil :wub:

I aint jumping on any bandwagon here, alfred dont need a sidekick, i dont read papers and i didnt know who neil moxley was until tonight.

But the games up chap.... alfred has blown the final whistle



Does the daily mail have a page 3? ...... *paper* oh my goodness look at those
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nm1968
Mick Harford
[ * ]

To those that have posted messages of support, my thanks.

To others, the reason why I came on here was to defend myself. Why should I have to put up with slurs against my character like that?

Yes, I'm a hack. Yes, I've withstood barbs that are worse than that. (Such as when Karren Brady told me I'd be sleeping in a cardboard box after I'd printed a story saying Jermaine Pennant had been sent home from training, drunk - and yes, I'm still waiting for the apology.)

I might well have signed up to this forum in the past but it's been that long that I re-registered. Simple explanation. I couldn't be bothered to share my thoughts, for fear that I'd just get slated. Well, I guess that has proved that assumption correct, hasn't it!

And to others who say I don't put my name to stories. Sorry, you are just wrong.

Basically, I was told on Saturday I was getting slagged off for that story. Lo and behold, when I'm proved right about Westley and ergo that Mutch's future could be in jeopardy, all of a sudden, I'm the anti-Christ. I believe that the relationship between Westley and Mutch could have a bearing on whether the player re-signs. Others don't. Take it or leave it, fellas. It's my opinion. I'm not slagging you off for yours. (Btw, I think he will go to Watford on loan again when the emergency window opens.)

So if the anonymous people on here want to discuss my credentials for covering this club, they can come and meet me, over a pint, and I'll happily tell them. It's not an invitation to engage in fisticuffs, I'd just rather meet any detractors face-to-face and give my side of the story. Who knows? I might even buy you one.

So, I'll be enjoying a pint Alfred, as I sometimes do. There may be tattoed men in there, Alfred, but don't be afraid. Honestly, your safety is assured.

And for your own personal information, not every story that goes to print needs to pass before a legal department. We'd not be able to produce a paper on a daily basis if that were the case.

And as for the assertion that I'm racist....do me a favour.

Never mind the fact you don't have a clue as to my own background, how else am I supposed to refer in print to Carson Yeung, Peter Pannu and the rest without either using their names or the collective term, 'Birmingham City's board.' over and over again?

Of course, I have, and do, refer to Randy Lerner as American. Just as I refer to Alex McLeish as a Scot. It's not racist to describe someone's nationality.

Furthermore, it's not me personally setting up any McLeish v The Board scenarios. I think you will find the de facto chief executive's comments on the day of the Manchester United game proved there was a schism. If I had written that there was an issue between the two before (and I don't know, I haven't checked) well then perhaps I saw that coming too. Well done me in that case.

So guys, thanks for taking the trouble to read this. I had hoped by putting my side of the story, that I could clarify matters.

If there are still those among you that disagree, fair enough. I respect that.

As for the rest of you, enjoy the rest of the season. And Wembley.

I know for a fact you have earned it....

Neil Moxley











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SimonBCFC
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Mike Skinner
[ *  *  *  *  *  * ]
I think I would make an excellent journo, can you get me a regular column in the paper Neil :dancer:
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SHA007
Geoff Horsfield
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
alfred E nueman
Feb 5 2011, 01:20 AM
For those of us under 50....
....are you sitting comfortably ?

Neil Moxley is a villa supporter. When he got his Mail contract it was as "Midlands Corespondent"

Just as we know - locally, that Tatts and Ross, whilst being bluenoses have to report when required in as nuetral a position as possible for baggies, wolves, Cov fans whatever.Even villa. That is what being a proper journo is about.

In the Daily Mail, most anti-blues, or even sarcastic about blues, comments originate from -
"A Staff Reporter".

Trust me, that is Moxley. Without the guts to put his name to something that has not been verified the tag line is "Staff Reporter" in the Mail.

Westley means nothing to the London media, just as whoever is the manager at the Crystal Palace Academy means little to the midlands or northern public. The hook is in the possibility of a promising youngster leaving because his mentor does.

Like Rooney walked out on Everton at 16 or Owen, Fowler, Gerrard at 16?

Trust me, that is Moxley writing up some bile under a protective "name" cover.
If there was any sense of reality about that, Tatts ...even Ross would have been on it first.
And Ross would have been putting in the digs about Westley a few weeks ago.  :D

Shame Man Utd won on Tuesday, we might have been spared this tishmosh-toshmosh from a third rate stringer. (Is that slander??)

:rolleyes:

:LMAO: :LMAO:

what a load of old tosh neuman. As per usual.

You and raphaelite have 3 things in common 1st the tosh you post 2nd the slagging off of fellow members and 3rd you cannot sspell your names. It's alfred e neuman not nueman...just like raphaelite.

Well done NM , You showed him.

**thumbup :LMAO:
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tony123
Alex Govan
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
nm1968

Mate Ive learned long since if you dont want to run the risk of getting slated then dont post on the forum.

I think the forum is quite healthy these days. Some posters come on here and vent. Sometimes they have a point if a player does badly he will get some flack. When it starts becoming nasty and just slating for the sake of it they slagged off for being bad supporters. It's understood that people will get frustrated and will give an opinion.

Same with me many people ask for the sick bag when they read my posts Im sure. I have my detractors and many dont agree with my views.

I couldnt give a monkeys because I know Im right.

;)
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mikem56
Martin Taylor
[ *  * ]
Fascinating stuff. A dialogue between a journalist and committed fans in which
reason, passion and prejudice prove perhaps just one thing. That die-hard conviction
can't be dented by facts.

Ironically, it's an old journo's joke:"Never let the facts get in the way of a good story!"

Appears it also applies, in some cases, to football fans convinced there's a media
conspiracy against their club. Suspect if you dropped in on a hundred other club forums
you'd pretty soon detect a similar vein of suspicion.

Full credit to Neil Moxley for taking on his detractors, but he may well have wondered by the end whether it had dented many of those convictions. Clearly not as far as conspiracy-monitor Alfred Neuman is concerned.

What every reporter knows is that wherever he goes there are people whose emotions and beliefs are so deeply entrenched that 'if you're not for us, you're agin us'.


However, this is just sport. Yet the same mind-set can operate.

It is not entirely unreasonable, having learnt that Terry Westley is leaving, to surmise that that may raise a question about the future of someone like Jordan Mutch, to whom he has clearly been close.

Is it not the sort of question many Blues' supporters, in pubs and clubs around Birmingham, might well have asked as well. That's what Mr Moxley was doing - raising the sort of legitimate question loyal fans might be asking.

Of course, all this stuff can be dealt with very effectively - by the club. A prompt statement on the club website, for instance, might be a good start.

Shooting messengers might be fun for conspiracy theorists. But it doesn't answer the questions the rest of us want answered.


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mybluearmy
Jose Dominguez
[ *  *  * ]
Hi Neil,

Thanks again for coming back on' the only issue I'd take with your reply is that whilst Terry Westleys departure was 'news' and all credit to you for being the first on the story; the Mutch element is, by your own admission, an opinion based on nothing more than the fact that Terry looked out for Jordon as a youth ayer; and completely negates any relationship the older Jordon may have with Alex McCleish and the other 1st/reserve term staff.

Of course you are perfectly entitled to your opinion, but the headline for the news was much more focused on a 'hypothetical' link to Jordon than it was to the 'actual' story, ie Westley going.

Doesn't make you the anti-Christ and there's no need for anyone to get personal, but I think the average fan may've found the assertion that Jordon could be off due to Westleys departure a little too 'circumstantial to be used as the headline for the story.

Anyway, credit to you for coming on and fighting your corner,

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Woodbine
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Mikael Forssell
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Quote:
 
As the old saying goes you can't make a pig from a sows ears holds true here.


:LMAO:
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clapton bluenose
Alex Govan
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
Woodbine
Feb 8 2011, 02:00 PM
Quote:
 
As the old saying goes you can't make a pig from a sows ears holds true here.


:LMAO:

Ok silk purse from a sows ears... :LMAO:
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thehod
Mikael Forssell
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
nm1968
Feb 8 2011, 09:56 AM
I believe that the relationship between Westley and Mutch could have a bearing on whether the player re-signs. Others don't. Take it or leave it, fellas. It's my opinion.

Let me just pick you up on this point Neil.

As a reporter, its not your job to give us your opinion, its your job to report facts. This isn't part of comment, this is part of the news section, and its all total speculation on your part. Some speculation that has been proved to be true, and some may yet prove to be true. But that's all beside the point.

A reporters job is to report the news, not to write the news.

Its not all your fault, of course, because in an era of rapidly diminishing returns for the print media, facts have become second place to rumour, rumour has become second place to speculation, and speculation has become second place to outright wishful thinking.

So I understand why you've reported that piece in the manner in which you have, because thats the way the media work now, especially in terms of football stories.

Still, it doesn't change the fact that its not reporting news is it?

And the way you've hooked the story, with the more solid fact of Westley's leaving being relegated behind the pure speculation of Mutch following him, which has been brought to the fore, and included in the headline.

The story is about Westley, but you've spun it to be about Mutch, a story that, when it comes to facts, you've got excatly zip.

Its lazy journalism Neil. By any standards, its lazy journalism. But then why should that matter, when its the only dish being served up by the print media and Sky Sports.

Woe betide that someone with a vested intrest in the football coverage this area gets, and the derision it recieves, should try to rise above that though.
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mybluearmy
Jose Dominguez
[ *  *  * ]
thehod
Feb 8 2011, 02:35 PM
nm1968
Feb 8 2011, 09:56 AM
I believe that the relationship between Westley and Mutch could have a bearing on whether the player re-signs. Others don't. Take it or leave it, fellas. It's my opinion.

Let me just pick you up on this point Neil.

As a reporter, its not your job to give us your opinion, its your job to report facts. This isn't part of comment, this is part of the news section, and its all total speculation on your part. Some speculation that has been proved to be true, and some may yet prove to be true. But that's all beside the point.

A reporters job is to report the news, not to write the news.

Its not all your fault, of course, because in an era of rapidly diminishing returns for the print media, facts have become second place to rumour, rumour has become second place to speculation, and speculation has become second place to outright wishful thinking.

So I understand why you've reported that piece in the manner in which you have, because thats the way the media work now, especially in terms of football stories.

Still, it doesn't change the fact that its not reporting news is it?

And the way you've hooked the story, with the more solid fact of Westley's leaving being relegated behind the pure speculation of Mutch following him, which has been brought to the fore, and included in the headline.

The story is about Westley, but you've spun it to be about Mutch, a story that, when it comes to facts, you've got excatly zip.

Its lazy journalism Neil. By any standards, its lazy journalism. But then why should that matter, when its the only dish being served up by the print media and Sky Sports.

Woe betide that someone with a vested intrest in the football coverage this area gets, and the derision it recieves, should try to rise above that though.

:applause: exactly what I said earlier.
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hellhound
Olivier Tebily
[ *  *  * ]
Woodbine
Feb 8 2011, 02:00 PM
Quote:
 
As the old saying goes you can't make a pig from a sows ears holds true here.


:LMAO:

Actually these days you can.
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Des
Malcom Page
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
Bloody hell Hod! Get back up that ladder mate your trying to take all your frustrations with modern day media out of poor old neil arent You!
Fact is he broke the news which has subsequently been proved correct!!
KRO
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Migster
Bob Latchford
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
"In its purest form, a newspaper consists of a collection of facts which, in controlled circumstances, can actively improve knowledge. Unfortunately, facts are expensive, so to save costs and drive up sales, unscrupulous dealers often "cut" the basic contents with cheaper material, such as wild opinion, bullsh*t, empty hysteria, reheated press releases, advertorial padding and photographs of Lady Gaga with her bum hanging out. The hapless user has little or no concept of the toxicity of the end product: they digest the contents in good faith, only to pay the price later when they find themselves raging incoherently in pubs, or – increasingly – on internet messageboards."

- Charlie Brooker's words.

The Daily Mail is a dreadful newspaper read by blustering old people in brown cardigans that hate anything different to themselves. And in this xenophobic rag, Of course our board are going to be described as Chinese at every opportunity, and remember, it's only our friendly hack "describing their nationality". If he could get away with putting "shifty" before it, he would, IMO.




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thehod
Mikael Forssell
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
Des
Feb 8 2011, 03:27 PM
Bloody hell Hod! Get back up that ladder mate your trying to take all your frustrations with modern day media out of poor old neil arent You!
Fact is he broke the news which has subsequently been proved correct!!
KRO

Half correct.
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hellhound
Olivier Tebily
[ *  *  * ]
Migster
Feb 8 2011, 03:33 PM
"In its purest form, a newspaper consists of a collection of facts which, in controlled circumstances, can actively improve knowledge. Unfortunately, facts are expensive, so to save costs and drive up sales, unscrupulous dealers often "cut" the basic contents with cheaper material, such as wild opinion, bullsh*t, empty hysteria, reheated press releases, advertorial padding and photographs of Lady Gaga with her bum hanging out. The hapless user has little or no concept of the toxicity of the end product: they digest the contents in good faith, only to pay the price later when they find themselves raging incoherently in pubs, or – increasingly – on internet messageboards."

- Charlie Brooker's words.

The Daily Mail is a dreadful newspaper read by blustering old people in brown cardigans that hate anything different to themselves. And in this xenophobic rag, Of course our board are going to be described as Chinese at every opportunity, and remember, it's only our friendly hack "describing their nationality". If he could get away with putting "shifty" before it, he would, IMO.

An interesesting definition but far too subjective to make any dictionary worth it's name. Incidentally, I don't read the Daily Mail (or any other newspaper for that matter) I think I'm just about intelligent enough to keep my own counsel on football matters and I'm not particularly interested in what other people have to say about Blues which is why I don't get too upset by such trivia.

Now what's happening in Egypt on the other hand- that's important.
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jassyblue80
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Trevor Francis
[ *  *  *  *  *  *  * ]
alfred E nueman
Feb 7 2011, 10:48 PM
jassyblue80
Feb 7 2011, 10:10 PM
Fair enough you are entitled to a response, what I can't see is how what you have quoted is slating the club? 1 piece is about the clubs finances, which everyone was talking about in the summer! 1 is an opinion which (unlike some seem to think is allowed) journos have!

1 thing I don't get is why people think asking questions or having an opinion means you are having a pop?

On the cup issue I would take a cup and relegation! Does that make me negative? I'm not saying I want it to happen. I want us to win the cup and stay up! But would love to see us win a cup!!

Having a pop !

Grow up Jassy, I thought better of you.

This is a journalist that has hid behind an anonymous psuedomym of "Staff Writer" for years - getting digs and slights in about blues.

He has now been forced to come clean, and has done.
With a pile of verbiage about how the Daily Mail allow anonymous and non-attributable items to be posted - by payroll staff - a national paper without a legal department protecting their online or ink statements?

:LMAO:

OKAY Jassy...find me a reference from Moxley ( and I wanted to withold this) find me ONE reference where he refers to Pannu or Yeung etc, as the owners of Blues.Without racial identity.

It is always the "chinese" say this....the "chinese owners say that"..."owned by chinese people"...unable to sort out the ownership in "chinese affairs"....

Now has he ever referred to Lerner as the "American boss"...the "foreign owner"...the "yankee" ?

Why should he, after 14 months have to preface any dig at our board with the adjective "chinese" ?

He says he is pro-blues ? Right ? He has had more slugs at our board in 12-14 months than he ever did against the Sullivan-Gold board in 12-14 years.
Has Tatts or Ross repeated every time our "chinese owners"? Of course not they are adult and sensible. So why does Moxley keep doing it?

Tell me why Jassy ?

Why do the Daily Mail readership need to be reminded every time he mentions blues that we are owned by "Chinese people"? What point is he reinforcing?

And on a very more negative note, beyond that naive racilist identificataion.....why does he always angle a story as if it is McLeish v The Board (chinese board that is).

A pre-determined path of always creating the idea that there exists a schism between manager and board (chinese board that is).
McLeish always loses getting funds for Pav, Keane, Zog etc - because of the board (chinese you know).
His players were cheap end and haven't delivered ( Gardner, Zigic, Bojangles etc) because the "chinese" board don't trust him/understand/are naive etc etc.

I could go on and on about this ONE journalist that has created more disharmony...and I probably will in weeks to come. ...amongst blues fans who quote his nonsense and worry....than any other London journo.

And why? Who is bothered about Blues nationally, other than this Moxley, who everytime he has to turn in a piece about us, it's anonymous slagg or the Board (chinese) v the manager.

I'm glad he was forced out to admit that his anonymous ramblings in the Daily Mail were from him - why he had to do it, and why he had to join this forum under a new name to explain - perhaps he will tell us in time.

In the meanwhile I will have to meet him, via cut-offs and men with tattoed lips somewhere in the vicinity of a pub...he is so important he can't risk being exposed. As if anyone cared FGS. :D

There you go Jass. Why I don't like or trust a journo like him.

**thumbup

See you haven't read my post properly, I wasn't accusing you as having a pop... just raising a question.

If I'm honest I don't know who this reporter is, I don't read said paper, hence I only have to go by what you have quoted, and I stand by my question, where is Neil having a dig in the pieces you have quoted?

One reason I don't read the mail is that it is right wing, and you get that type of language used throughout the paper, whether they are talking politics, sport or weather.

However they are not alone... it seems to be a common theme when talking about foreign owners these days... earlier on SSN they talked about Blackburn’s owners and referred to their nationality. Why? I don't know, but all papers, TV coverage etc seems to do it these days??


There are a couple of examples here where moxley has refered to the nationality of learner an former boss oneil

That sort of deal would be outside of our means,' said the American Lerner when asked if they would sign a £30million striker.

Yes, Villa had finished sixth three seasons in a row under the Ulsterman, but they were going to have to grow the hard way - use academy players, make shrewd, cheaper signings, get the best out of what they had at the club already.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/cricket/a...l#ixzz1DNrqBqwd

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blondblunose
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Paul Tait
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
hellhound
Feb 8 2011, 03:54 PM
I think I'm just about intelligent enough to keep my own counsel on football matters

You sure about that?

:LOL:
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jassyblue80
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Trevor Francis
[ *  *  *  *  *  *  * ]
thehod
Feb 8 2011, 02:35 PM
nm1968
Feb 8 2011, 09:56 AM
I believe that the relationship between Westley and Mutch could have a bearing on whether the player re-signs. Others don't. Take it or leave it, fellas. It's my opinion.

Let me just pick you up on this point Neil.

As a reporter, its not your job to give us your opinion, its your job to report facts. This isn't part of comment, this is part of the news section, and its all total speculation on your part. Some speculation that has been proved to be true, and some may yet prove to be true. But that's all beside the point.

A reporters job is to report the news, not to write the news.

Its not all your fault, of course, because in an era of rapidly diminishing returns for the print media, facts have become second place to rumour, rumour has become second place to speculation, and speculation has become second place to outright wishful thinking.

So I understand why you've reported that piece in the manner in which you have, because thats the way the media work now, especially in terms of football stories.

Still, it doesn't change the fact that its not reporting news is it?

And the way you've hooked the story, with the more solid fact of Westley's leaving being relegated behind the pure speculation of Mutch following him, which has been brought to the fore, and included in the headline.

The story is about Westley, but you've spun it to be about Mutch, a story that, when it comes to facts, you've got excatly zip.

Its lazy journalism Neil. By any standards, its lazy journalism. But then why should that matter, when its the only dish being served up by the print media and Sky Sports.

Woe betide that someone with a vested intrest in the football coverage this area gets, and the derision it recieves, should try to rise above that though.

I totally agree, however, the internet, 24 hour news coverage has helped move away from old style jounalism. if you don't speculate now as a journo then you could be 24 hours behind... but no one seems to mind if you are wrong these days... you "broke" a story if it is true... and it is brushed under the carpet if not, with another story breaking, people forget the last one!! :(
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thehod
Mikael Forssell
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
jassyblue80
Feb 8 2011, 04:10 PM
I totally agree, however, the internet, 24 hour news coverage has helped move away from old style jounalism. if you don't speculate now as a journo then you could be 24 hours behind... but no one seems to mind if you are wrong these days... you "broke" a story if it is true... and it is brushed under the carpet if not, with another story breaking, people forget the last one!! :(

Well yes, and that's the issue.

Everyone so eager to be the first to break the next big news that they'll use the shotgun effect hoping that something will get hit.

I can remember seeing some figures a while back that said that the Mirror reported on 200 transfer stories in a given period, and only 25% turned out to come to fruition. That's an appalling accuracy rate.

Now not all of this is the fault of the media, as a lot of those stories are agent driven, but if the media didn't report an agents story as if there was a shred of truth in it, then they wouldn't get such a hard time for making stuff up.

News reporting has changed, but then so has peoples trust in what the media report. Especially when it comes to football.

But, like I said, its a shame most journalists decide to be part of that race, rather than trying to make a name for themselves as a source of trust and accuracy.
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jassyblue80
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Trevor Francis
[ *  *  *  *  *  *  * ]
thehod
Feb 8 2011, 04:19 PM
jassyblue80
Feb 8 2011, 04:10 PM
I totally agree, however, the internet, 24 hour news coverage has helped move away from old style jounalism. if you don't speculate now as a journo then you could be 24 hours behind... but no one seems to mind if you are wrong these days... you "broke" a story if it is true... and it is brushed under the carpet if not, with another story breaking, people forget the last one!!  :(

Well yes, and that's the issue.

Everyone so eager to be the first to break the next big news that they'll use the shotgun effect hoping that something will get hit.

I can remember seeing some figures a while back that said that the Mirror reported on 200 transfer stories in a given period, and only 25% turned out to come to fruition. That's an appalling accuracy rate.

Now not all of this is the fault of the media, as a lot of those stories are agent driven, but if the media didn't report an agents story as if there was a shred of truth in it, then they wouldn't get such a hard time for making stuff up.

News reporting has changed, but then so has peoples trust in what the media report. Especially when it comes to football.

But, like I said, its a shame most journalists decide to be part of that race, rather than trying to make a name for themselves as a source of trust and accuracy.

**thumbup

I wonder what SSN accuracy rate is?
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hellhound
Olivier Tebily
[ *  *  * ]
blondblunose
Feb 8 2011, 04:07 PM
hellhound
Feb 8 2011, 03:54 PM
I think I'm just about intelligent enough to keep my own counsel on football matters

You sure about that?

:LOL:

Yep.
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thehod
Mikael Forssell
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
jassyblue80
Feb 8 2011, 04:23 PM
I wonder what SSN accuracy rate is?

When it comes to reporting that a deal is done, close to being done, attempting to be done, or we're hoping that something happens as there's booger all going on at the moment and we can only distract you with the hot looking chick with the big norks for so long?

Pretty bad I'd say.
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hellhound
Olivier Tebily
[ *  *  * ]
thehod
Feb 8 2011, 04:29 PM
jassyblue80
Feb 8 2011, 04:23 PM
I wonder what SSN accuracy rate is?

When it comes to reporting that a deal is done, close to being done, attempting to be done, or we're hoping that something happens as there's booger all going on at the moment and we can only distract you with the hot looking chick with the big norks for so long?

Pretty bad I'd say.

When you think it through Hod, most of the time there's no news most of the time so I guess hot looking chicks with big norks are better than an empty screen. On the other hand some of the girlies on here might prefer a hot looking guy with an impressive bulge in his pants.
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spliffy
Geoff Horsfield
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
to save me reading all through the thread,,,has he gone or not ?
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